Twice dawns the day

[Screwtape]

Hi all. I'm a newbie here so be gentle, please. :)

Anyway, I haven't seen this before but I'm sure it was posted somewhere else but the part about prophecy with Rand and "twice the day dawns" (I forget the actual quote). I've always thought this refers to a solar eclipse. What think you?

FWIW

Screwtape

[Buckweet]

Yea thats seems to be a real popular one, but I have one myself that I think is screwy but makes pefect sense.. If Rand chills and watches the sunrise and then Travels to a place a bit more west, then the day dawns twice :)

I dont think its an eclipse only because strictly a dawn is the rising of the sun from the east.

What do ya guys think ??

[Jacob]

I had never thought of the possebility of it being an eclipse. Actually, I hadn't really thought about it that much. "Twice dawns the day when his blood is shed...". Maybe it's just a metaphore. I donno, I mean maybe there WILL be dawn twice, however, since RJ has made WOT follow the general laws or reality (world revolving around the sun, world being round etc.) I can't really see him trying to pull off two actual dawn without night inbetween. Maybe there'll be a "superman incident" where time is turned back so that the same dawn will happen twice? Break the wheel (of time), re-make the wheel.

[Tinkers Sword]

I think your right Jacob, I think that maybe the Dark One will escape for an instant and thus utter darkness will decend as the world is remade in his image. But at the same instant Rand will Defeat him and somehow in the process the day will start afresh.

A bit vague but a don't think any but RJ is going to know the ending before the end.

[Theoban]

The problem lies in the prophecy. It says "Twice dawns the day" and that could mean anything, with a little poetic licence. Eclipse? Time Travel? DO?

Although if RJ is dealing in Norse legends, then what about the wolf that eats the sun? This signals Ragnarok, so the wolf could be the DO in the WOT universe.

[Buckweet]

What if he ws in Rhuidean the day the last batlle and saw the sun rise. Then he getst the troopage together and goes to the bore. (more to the west)

The sun will dawn there the same DAY... am I the only one who sees this?????

[Tinkers Sword]

I think the prophecy implies that this is an event experienced by all. Your explanation is way to simplistic in relation to the scope of WoT.

[Buckweet]

well an eclipse isnt global, at most half a sphere is exposed to the sun.... and the moon is much smaller, I remember there being an eclipse in hawaii when I was a kid, and I was dissapointed that I didnt see it. by the way Im in NJ. At most an eclipse covers only a couple thousand square mile,,, shrugs~~ just a guess though.

[Mithrandir]

We must see the whole Prophecy and see the conection i think;

Prophecy:
"Twice dawns the day when his blood is shed.
Once for mourning, once for birth.
Red on black, the Dragon's blood stains the rock of Shayol Ghul.
In the Pit of Doom shall his blood free men from the Shadow."

So see what we make of this

[Urbal T]

I've always thought it was a metaphor for rand's "rebirth."

he's "He Who Comes with the Dawn" right?
He comes, dies, is alive again?

I've always thought that, but the breaking the wheel and starting anew is attractive too.

--Ted

[Archbishop]

I agree with Buckweet in that it's probably something simplistic and, therefore, unexpected. I don't have any theory that I favor on this topic, but has anyone considered the possibility that it is simply two consecutive days of combat during which Rand's blood is shed twice (for each day). The prophecy does not necessarily suggest that the two days must be the same.

[Maliki]

So far RJ has guaranteed that none of the prophesies are simple. And all of them seem to have more than one meaning. The one that made him Car'a'carn, refers both to the dragons on his arms and the fact that the secret name of the Aeil is people of the Dragon. So I would suspect that "twice dawns the day" will also have more than one meaning, but the one that seems to fit best is a short amount of time travel

[flyingdutchman]

short and simple:

day dawns for rand -> rand lives on
day dawns for lews therin-> LT dies

i have no intention whatsoever to support this claim with evidence, just a guess dirived from jordan's writing style. but i'm right anyway, wait and see!

[LaughingTurtle]

day dawns for lews therin-> LT dies
WHAT?? I die....AHHHHHHHH!!! :eek:

You sicko FDM, trying to predict my death....grrrr :mad:


heh, heh, heh ;)

[Tinkers Sword]

"once for death & once for birth"

What if the birth mentioned is the Birth of Rand and Elayne's child.
I heard this somewhere before, but if it is true then that means there only about 8 months left 'till Tarmon Gai'dan.

[Screwtape]

Okay, I don't have WH with me right now but did Rand knock up Elayne? There is some speculation that Aveindra is with child and I remember (I think) Min saying that Elayne would have twins. Is that a done deal or a "it's gonna happen down the road" kind of thing?

[Kiri]

I like the idea that Lewis Therin may die - and therefore be mourned - because he was the dragon, as is Rand.

And that once Lewis Therin dies, Rand is reborn completely unto himself. No dead people trying to take over his soul and all that.

Lewis Therin has in some ways been reborn or reincarnated into Rand's body, but if I remember correctly, somewhere in the series it mentions how there can only be ONE!

How does that sound?

What's this about Elayne being pregnant with Rand's child? I either missed that or totally forgot about it in the muddled mess of my mind.

Cheers from down under.

[Mithrandir]

Min had a viewing over Rand and LTT, and that one of those was gonna survive (or am i wrong?) so that is a possibility

[Buckweet]

remember the silly diet of poridge and nasty stuff fr elayne... how she pretends its the dark friends baby just so she can protect it and what have you?

[TheDude99]

Originally posted by Tinkers Sword
I think your right Jacob, I think that maybe the Dark One will escape for an instant and thus utter darkness will decend as the world is remade in his image. But at the same instant Rand will Defeat him and somehow in the process the day will start afresh

i need to go off a little bit...
didn't lews therin say to ishmael, in that moment of sanity before he destroyed everything, "for ten years your master has touched the world"... i'm pretty sure i've seen someone say something about this before, but i had to follow it up a bit:
the dark one is in a prison, with a hole in it... he can't just get out and wreck havoc... well, maybe some... but it takes him time to touch the world more and more... so even after all the seals are broken, the DO won't be able to do everything he wants in just one day

[Buckweet]

yea dude,

The opening the seal opens the "Hole" not his prson...he wouldnt be free... he would only be able to stick his finger out a bit and wiggle it...Now, what sticking his finger out and wiggling it does?? who knows...guess we get to find out, my guess there would be a lot of wierd ass miasmas loose, and not just near the three tavereens.... hmm I wonder... when was the lsst miasma,...what book?.. 3? 4?... I think its been a while...can anyone check or something , I dont have my books anywhere close by....*sigh*
~~curses his brother by shaking fist to the east~; the Rowan Atkins way~~~

[Tinkers Sword]

I think the last Miasma was in book 6 in Salidar. But I think they are happening all the time to people throughout the world. The 3 lads expierenced the initial blasts.

As for the extent the Dark One will be able to touch the world I think depends on weather Rand Breaks the seals or the Dark One does. Why is Lews so adament to destroy the seals? Is it because that by the Dark One Destroying them he is some way gaining power or enlarging the bore?

[Theoban]

The last miasma was in book 7 when Rand is with the rebels, and the fog arrives. Although Padan Fain is not harmed by it, and it bears a resemblence to Mashadar, if he could call it, I think he would have done so before.

[archely]

No way, that was fain's work all the way. The fact that it doesn't harm him is the biggest give away. I mean, think about the battle between the evil in Rand's side wound. If that were a miasma from the dark one's prison, it should have messed up fain more than anyone else there.

[baxts]

could the second dawning of the ssame day be caused by the use of too much balefire?? if rand must see two dawns of the same day, one to die and one to live, then mayby the fight at shayol ghul begins in the early morn, lasts a while, and then rand uses the great sa'angreal (sorry, cheandar thingy however you spell it) to blast the DO with b/f, in the process taking out most of the day so only he remembers, reviving all the dead that shaitan had killed, and once the (simple??) matter of a few forsaken and dreadlords are dealt with again (easy with rands sa'angreal, especially now the taints bin removed).....everyone lives happily ever after!! of course during the day we have to lose LTT sumwhere, but dont have theories on that. no basis for this theory other than R/Js style and i reckon itd b cool!!

[baxts]

sorry, posted wrong place!!